Proposed changes to the R Language

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Proposed changes to the R Language

Angus C Hewitt (DHHS)
Hi Team,

Please advise if there are any plans in the pipeline for change the R language to "B"  as proposed in the below mentioned statistical series help at Auckland Uni.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88TftllIjaY


Kind Regards,

Angus Hewitt
Senior Analyst | Decision Support
System Design, Planning & Decision Making |  Health & Well Being
Department of Health and Human Services | 19th floor, 50 Lonsdale Street, Melbourne Victoria 3000
t. 9096 5859  | m. 0468 364 744 | e. [hidden email]



        [[alternative HTML version deleted]]

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Re: Proposed changes to the R Language

Jeff Newmiller
I have no idea. But I hope not... that sounds like a different tool than R, just as C++ is a different tool than C.

On December 27, 2018 4:36:42 PM PST, "Angus C Hewitt (DHHS)" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>Hi Team,
>
>Please advise if there are any plans in the pipeline for change the R
>language to "B"  as proposed in the below mentioned statistical series
>help at Auckland Uni.
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88TftllIjaY
>
>
>Kind Regards,
>
>Angus Hewitt
>Senior Analyst | Decision Support
>System Design, Planning & Decision Making |  Health & Well Being
>Department of Health and Human Services | 19th floor, 50 Lonsdale
>Street, Melbourne Victoria 3000
>t. 9096 5859  | m. 0468 364 744 | e. [hidden email]
>
>
>
> [[alternative HTML version deleted]]
>
>______________________________________________
>[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
>https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
>PLEASE do read the posting guide
>http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
>and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.

--
Sent from my phone. Please excuse my brevity.

______________________________________________
[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
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Re: Proposed changes to the R Language

Bert Gunter-2
I would assume r-devel is where this sort of query should be posted as we
mere users have nothing to say about this.

However, I've seen discussions and talks about better languages for
scientific (but data science?) programming -- Matlab, Julia, Scipy, etc. --
for at least a decade. But with a library of now over 10,000 packages on
CRAN and yet more on Bioconductor and github -- that's a lot of inertia to
overcome.

Cheers,
Bert


Bert Gunter

"The trouble with having an open mind is that people keep coming along and
sticking things into it."
-- Opus (aka Berkeley Breathed in his "Bloom County" comic strip )


On Fri, Dec 28, 2018 at 7:13 AM Jeff Newmiller <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> I have no idea. But I hope not... that sounds like a different tool than
> R, just as C++ is a different tool than C.
>
> On December 27, 2018 4:36:42 PM PST, "Angus C Hewitt (DHHS)" <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
> >Hi Team,
> >
> >Please advise if there are any plans in the pipeline for change the R
> >language to "B"  as proposed in the below mentioned statistical series
> >help at Auckland Uni.
> >
> >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88TftllIjaY
> >
> >
> >Kind Regards,
> >
> >Angus Hewitt
> >Senior Analyst | Decision Support
> >System Design, Planning & Decision Making |  Health & Well Being
> >Department of Health and Human Services | 19th floor, 50 Lonsdale
> >Street, Melbourne Victoria 3000
> >t. 9096 5859  | m. 0468 364 744 | e. [hidden email]
> >
> >
> >
> >       [[alternative HTML version deleted]]
> >
> >______________________________________________
> >[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
> >https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
> >PLEASE do read the posting guide
> >http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
> >and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>
> --
> Sent from my phone. Please excuse my brevity.
>
> ______________________________________________
> [hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
> PLEASE do read the posting guide
> http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>

        [[alternative HTML version deleted]]

______________________________________________
[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
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Re: Proposed changes to the R Language

jacob bogers
In reply to this post by Angus C Hewitt (DHHS)
It has some good ideas, but R (my personal assesment) is not build for
superspeed, but for superease of use.))


On Fri, Dec 28, 2018 at 3:01 PM Angus C Hewitt (DHHS) <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Team,
>
> Please advise if there are any plans in the pipeline for change the R
> language to "B"  as proposed in the below mentioned statistical series help
> at Auckland Uni.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88TftllIjaY
>
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> Angus Hewitt
> Senior Analyst | Decision Support
> System Design, Planning & Decision Making |  Health & Well Being
> Department of Health and Human Services | 19th floor, 50 Lonsdale Street,
> Melbourne Victoria 3000
> t. 9096 5859  | m. 0468 364 744 | e. [hidden email]
>
>
>
>         [[alternative HTML version deleted]]
>
> ______________________________________________
> [hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
> PLEASE do read the posting guide
> http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>

        [[alternative HTML version deleted]]

______________________________________________
[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
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Re: Proposed changes to the R Language

angus hewitt
In reply to this post by Jeff Newmiller
Hi Jeff,

The suggested language looks like it is shifting to some stricter programming idioms such as defining object's data structure. this video was shoot in 2017 so I'm not sure if these changes have been put on the back burier.

AH
________________________________
From: Jeff Newmiller <[hidden email]>
Sent: Friday, 28 December 2018 3:13 PM
To: [hidden email]; Angus C Hewitt (DHHS)
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [R] Proposed changes to the R Language

I have no idea. But I hope not... that sounds like a different tool than R, just as C++ is a different tool than C.

On December 27, 2018 4:36:42 PM PST, "Angus C Hewitt (DHHS)" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>Hi Team,
>
>Please advise if there are any plans in the pipeline for change the R
>language to "B"  as proposed in the below mentioned statistical series
>help at Auckland Uni.
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88TftllIjaY
>
>
>Kind Regards,
>
>Angus Hewitt
>Senior Analyst | Decision Support
>System Design, Planning & Decision Making |  Health & Well Being
>Department of Health and Human Services | 19th floor, 50 Lonsdale
>Street, Melbourne Victoria 3000
>t. 9096 5859  | m. 0468 364 744 | e. [hidden email]
>
>
>
>       [[alternative HTML version deleted]]
>
>______________________________________________
>[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
>https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
>PLEASE do read the posting guide
>http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
>and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.

--
Sent from my phone. Please excuse my brevity.

        [[alternative HTML version deleted]]

______________________________________________
[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
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Re: Proposed changes to the R Language

Jeff Newmiller
I don't think you can assume that any of this _research_ was ever on any R-core burner at all. But as Bert said, this would not be where such discussion occurred if it was... go to r-devel to find out, or better yet contact the researchers themselves.

On December 29, 2018 9:53:01 PM PST, angus hewitt <[hidden email]> wrote:

>Hi Jeff,
>
>The suggested language looks like it is shifting to some stricter
>programming idioms such as defining object's data structure. this video
>was shoot in 2017 so I'm not sure if these changes have been put on the
>back burier.
>
>AH
>________________________________
>From: Jeff Newmiller <[hidden email]>
>Sent: Friday, 28 December 2018 3:13 PM
>To: [hidden email]; Angus C Hewitt (DHHS)
>Cc: [hidden email]
>Subject: Re: [R] Proposed changes to the R Language
>
>I have no idea. But I hope not... that sounds like a different tool
>than R, just as C++ is a different tool than C.
>
>On December 27, 2018 4:36:42 PM PST, "Angus C Hewitt (DHHS)"
><[hidden email]> wrote:
>>Hi Team,
>>
>>Please advise if there are any plans in the pipeline for change the R
>>language to "B"  as proposed in the below mentioned statistical series
>>help at Auckland Uni.
>>
>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88TftllIjaY
>>
>>
>>Kind Regards,
>>
>>Angus Hewitt
>>Senior Analyst | Decision Support
>>System Design, Planning & Decision Making |  Health & Well Being
>>Department of Health and Human Services | 19th floor, 50 Lonsdale
>>Street, Melbourne Victoria 3000
>>t. 9096 5859  | m. 0468 364 744 | e. [hidden email]
>>
>>
>>
>>       [[alternative HTML version deleted]]
>>
>>______________________________________________
>>[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
>>https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
>>PLEASE do read the posting guide
>>http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
>>and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>
>--
>Sent from my phone. Please excuse my brevity.

--
Sent from my phone. Please excuse my brevity.

______________________________________________
[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
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Re: Proposed changes to the R Language

J C Nash
My friend Morven Gentleman who died recently was for some time chair of the computer
faculty at Waterloo and (Fortune nomination!) once said "The response of many computer
scientists to any problem is to invent a new programming language."

Looking at Ross Ihaka's video, I got the impression he wants to preserve R syntax as
much as possible while improving speed and predictability. His example

  x=10
  f=function(){
   if (runif(1) > .5) x=20
   x
  }

where the local/global status of x is unclear underlines just one issue.

The temptation with programming languages is to allow them to expand. That makes
it very much more expensive and difficult to preserve the package ecosystem in a
healthy and verifiable state. A robust dialog between users and language
developers is, I believe, the best way to move to a streamlining of R. If -- and
that is the big question -- Ross' ideas are workable to provide a simplified
R (whatever we call it) that allows a high proportion of existing codes to run
satisfactorily or with minimal/automated changes, the R community would benefit.


John Nash

______________________________________________
[hidden email] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.